Super tuner calibrations

[Simpatico]

In Sweden we have about 5% ethanol but this will certanly increas in the future.

I think it would be a better option to load the calibration as is (with closed loop operation) and run some smart tuning and adjust the VE tables to deal with the ethanol content. If I decrease the AFR values I also shut off the closed loop operation. Am I right?
On heavy loads it would be possible to decrease AFR but for such low ethanol content I guess the situation would be same but different.

/Marcus

 

[Hoople]

Only 5%...
I have never used Smart Tune myself but yes it seems to be another approach. Make copies of the before Smart Tune VE tables and the after. I would like to know what you find that actually takes place.
Yes, to maintain closed loop cells as they are, a global uplift in VE numbers would be needed.

Also keep an eye on o2 sensor bias as well. I could easily see Smart Tune shifting that value in an attempt to correct for ethanol.

 

[Simpatico]

I'm afraid I won't be smart tuning for a while. It's getting close to 0 deg C here now. The winter is approaching.

While looking at the different calibrations I get more and more confused.
If I, in my calibration (176AE106) put in 14.5 in the AFR table the bold font disappear, indicating that closed loop operation is no longer present. Thecalibration for the 2010 Touring (009FY002) is filled with an AFR value of 14.3 and is bolded. And in that calibration the Cloosed loop bias is not present. Don't they have the same type of O2 sensors?
Another thing is that in the 2011 Softail there is no throttle progresitivity as in 2010 touring. As far as I know they both have the electronic throttle control.

I feel that there is no consistency between different calibrations. Neither in the datasetting nor in the things open to the user.


When reflashing the ECM there is an option "reset adaptive fuel". I think an adaption due to the fuel quality (amount of carbon) is made and added on the way between the AFR table and the actual amount of fuel delivered by the injectors. This would imply that smart tune should be performed on a newly reflashed and reseted ECM.


Let me know if you would like to have some of the calibration files for the 2010-2011 models.


/Macus

 

[Hoople]

I get more and more confused.
If I, in my calibration (176AE106) put in 14.5 in the AFR table the bold font disappear, indicating that closed loop operation is no longer present.

Yes it is a Very confusing topic because we really don't know how the fuel maps are being used by the Delphi ECM.

A Perfect Example:
The Bosch o2 sensor that we have on our bikes can be used for many types of fuel. Storich for gasoline is 14.7. Stoich for ethanol is 9.0. But in BOTH cases the output of the sensor is the same (~.5 volts) and only the scale on the Air/fuel ratio meter must be changed.!

Some may ask "how is that possible".,.It is possible because the o2 sensor is just looking for a "lack of" or an "abundance of" oxygen molecules and does NOT really care (or has any idea) what fuel you are using. When you combine the proper amount of FUEL (any fuel) with the proper amount of oxygen molecules you will be at stoich. That is ALL the o2 sensor cares about,, and that is the AMOUNT of o2 in the exhaust stream.

This is the reason why Lambda is so widely used instead of an actual a/f ratio number.
Stoich for gasoline is 1.0 Lambda (14.7)
Stoich for Ethanol is 1.0 Lambda (9.0)
Stoich for propane is 1.0 Lambda (15.5)
Stoich for methanol is 1.0 Lambda (6.4)


So..! the big question is why does the SEST air/fuel ratio maps shift all the numbers downhill when you click on 10% Ethanol w/ a touring map? When you think about it, it really should not because we really don't want to SHIFT our a/f ratio. All we really want to do is compensate for the 10% ethanol. I believe (my theory) it shows that only for ease of understanding and actually does NOT perform the function like it appears.

The REAL answer to this question would require talking to the software developers or having the source code for the assembly language of the firmware which Delphi would never release in a million years.

 

[Simpatico]

So..! the big question is why does the SEST air/fuel ratio maps shift all the numbers downhill when you click on 10% Ethanol w/ a touring map? When you think about it, it really should not because we really don't want to SHIFT our a/f ratio. All we really want to do is compensate for the 10% ethanol. I believe (my theory) it shows that only for ease of understanding and actually does NOT perform the function like it appears.
.

Well, the AFR should be lower when the ethanol content increases. If we want to maintain lambda, which is what we want, we mustn't inject the same amount of fuel as if we had pristine petrol. If you look at the preferred lambda values in the touring calibration you cannot change them in the same way as the AFR values by blending in ethanol. My guess is that the "adaptive fuel " is a map with correction values in the open loop region that corrects the injection time to compensate for the fuel mixture and the specific injector.
This way there should not be a need for specifying the amount of ethanol in the petrol. After a while the ECM would learn how much carbon you have in your fuel. This would only work assuming that the maximum values of the adaptiv values is large enough to compensate for the specific amount of ethanol.
As you say it would be very nice to have a look at the documentation of the code in the ECM but that will as you say never happend.

/Marcus

 

[Hoople]

After a while the ECM would learn how much carbon you have in your fuel. This would only work assuming that the maximum values of the adaptiv values is large enough to compensate for the specific amount of ethanol.

/Marcus

Interesting point but I am not sure if that can be true. The reason I say that is based on the fact that we have narrow band O2 sensors in our bikes and they only can understand A/F ratios from maybe 14.3 to 14.8 (a .5 spread of 1 a/f ratio point).

So knowing that any open loop cells must be calculated from "look up tables only", during those times I can Not see the ECM TRULY learning anything. (maybe forced learned but not truly learning) Based on that assumption, this "adaptive fuel" sub-program will only work in closed loop areas. Therefore to me, when in any non-closed loop cell areas, the system is Not (can not) learn anything. It can't learn due to the fact the o2 sensor is narrow band. (just my theory)

Now on the other hand, if we were using true wide band sensors & controllers, the ECM could understand AFR's in the 10:1 region, and a learning process (adaptive fuel, smart tune) could really take place. To me, Smart Tune only has a learning region of .5 of 1 A/F ratio point.
(just my theory)

Whether my theory(s) are right or wrong, I myself am willing to accept a little waste of fuel and run a system that is "look up tables only" as you would find in pre-o2 Delphi systems. Yes my fuel mileage is not peaked as it would be in closed loop but I am willing to pay that price. At any given engine load, at any given RPM, I know what my A/F ratio is (within reason) because it was defined by hand. I have matched my "desired" A/F table to what is actual via the VE tables.

Besides I have always been very "thick-headed" when it comes to allowing unknown background programs to protect me from myself. If I could both steer and drive those programs and it's decision making, I would be more agreeable to them.

 

[Hoople]

I'm afraid I won't be smart tuning for a while. It's getting close to 0 deg C here now. The winter is approaching.
/Macus

Macus, I just re-read your post.. You got bigger problems than just an Air/Fuel Ratio if it's already 0*C and still October in Sweden. How did you guys escape the "Global Warming" issue we have here in the U.S. Can you still buy R12 Freon in Sweden..

We were told the planet earth would boil away if my car leaked out it's freon

 

[Simpatico]

Hi,

Yes I have bigger problem than just the fine tuning. I want to go out and take my newly tuned Harley for a test ride. Now there is a few degrees plus (~8) but it has rained alot. Hopefully the roads will dry up and the temperature will be over zero degrees so I can take it for a ride.

/Marcus

 

[rancid]

just a quick one to let you know, the 11 softail map is different because the bike has a bcm now to control the switches on the bike, this talks differently to the ecm and requires a different set up to the dyna.